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PostPosted: Tue Mar 20, 2007 7:15 pm 
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excellent post andy.....true words, very true words

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 20, 2007 7:25 pm 
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24db wrote:
rattymouse wrote:
24db wrote:
epsilon75 wrote:
24db wrote:
Can't see TD bothering with the US in any major way again, it's far too expensive


Yes............i think that has a lot to do with it IMHO :arrow: No good doing a big tour to half empty venues :!:


Yeah, it's a shame for the 6 real fans they have left...just kidding lads ;)


You arent far off. I cant see TD drawing any type of crowd here in the US. They have just abandoned us for far too long. And the sad part was that they were at one time pretty huge here. They made a lot of money selling big time tickets to very large concert halls. Now, no one would even know who they are. and I have to ask, WHY did it come to this? Why did one of the best bands in the world fail so miserably?


This is my opinion, not the truth, just my view:

Cost....simple as that, it would be so simple to say, oh if they still played this or that or they had all the old members in the group, then they'd be huge. But TDI/Eastgate are small, massive tours of the US nearly brought TD to their knees in 1977 and that was with the might of Virgin Records behind them. I'm going out on a limb here, but I don't think the cancelled tour of 2001 was everything to do with 9/11, sadly I think it 'might' be more down to Monica dying, Edgar says he seriously though about giving up music. I admire him for still carrying on, still doing the odd gig...it must have been very hard for him and Jerome.

I've said this, but venue size isn't a 100% accurate way to gauge popularity, you can compare anything in TD's history and prove whatever you like, like all disperate things all you prove in that two things are different (eg, TD play to 80,000 people in Berlin and then play to 2000 people in the UK in 1981...did their fan base collapse? TD play to half full halls during some of their 1974 gigs, and yet play to 50,000 in France a year later...it goes on and on). But, I agree we all know that TD aren't the major 'selling' force that they were once, their clothes have been stolen by others, even the gimmick of EM and synthesisers is gone. What you have now is TD: the band, that is still producing good (or bad) music depending on your taste, preconceptions and whether you love the technology more than the music (and there still are technology fan boys) who want to re live again and again a certain style.

If they've lost fans due to their change in style, then I say this...an artist does not produce art for fans passing tastes. Jerome said this recently, you listen to them but you don't play or compose what they want, that's art by community...you might as well let fans vote for chords changes and which sounds you use. The fans you have one day are the same that will be kicking your head in 6 months later (from memory TD had bomb threats and fans sending them their smashed records....and these are the fans! imagine what people who don't like them did).

where did that soap box come from? ;)

As unlikely as it sounds I do agree with you, it's just that perhaps I don't see things as 'black and white' as some.


Who is some?.... those who see things in Black and White are those who would say music fails so miserably due of its lack of popularity, don't you think?

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 20, 2007 8:03 pm 
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Good post Andy with some very valid points :wink: Still far too many arses stuck in 1975 mate :arrow:

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 20, 2007 8:03 pm 
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A lot of artists bow to the record label they are with. They record a record the company want and not what they would like to do. As far as I know appart from soundtracks TD have NEVER done this. An example is David Bowies 'Lets Dance' Mr. Bowie loathed that record at the time and still does. The record company EMI america wanted that kind of 80's sounding album which Bowie obliged them with.Having said that Let's Dance sold well. It still is IMO one of DB's worst records.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 20, 2007 8:07 pm 
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Have to agree there John,that has to be one of DB,s worse along with that horrendous version of "Dancing in the Streets" him and Jagger did :oops: :oops: mind you,it made a huge amount of money 8)

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 20, 2007 8:09 pm 
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Desert_Voyager wrote:
24db wrote:
rattymouse wrote:
24db wrote:
epsilon75 wrote:
24db wrote:
Can't see TD bothering with the US in any major way again, it's far too expensive


Yes............i think that has a lot to do with it IMHO :arrow: No good doing a big tour to half empty venues :!:


Yeah, it's a shame for the 6 real fans they have left...just kidding lads ;)


You arent far off. I cant see TD drawing any type of crowd here in the US. They have just abandoned us for far too long. And the sad part was that they were at one time pretty huge here. They made a lot of money selling big time tickets to very large concert halls. Now, no one would even know who they are. and I have to ask, WHY did it come to this? Why did one of the best bands in the world fail so miserably?


This is my opinion, not the truth, just my view:

Cost....simple as that, it would be so simple to say, oh if they still played this or that or they had all the old members in the group, then they'd be huge. But TDI/Eastgate are small, massive tours of the US nearly brought TD to their knees in 1977 and that was with the might of Virgin Records behind them. I'm going out on a limb here, but I don't think the cancelled tour of 2001 was everything to do with 9/11, sadly I think it 'might' be more down to Monica dying, Edgar says he seriously though about giving up music. I admire him for still carrying on, still doing the odd gig...it must have been very hard for him and Jerome.

I've said this, but venue size isn't a 100% accurate way to gauge popularity, you can compare anything in TD's history and prove whatever you like, like all disperate things all you prove in that two things are different (eg, TD play to 80,000 people in Berlin and then play to 2000 people in the UK in 1981...did their fan base collapse? TD play to half full halls during some of their 1974 gigs, and yet play to 50,000 in France a year later...it goes on and on). But, I agree we all know that TD aren't the major 'selling' force that they were once, their clothes have been stolen by others, even the gimmick of EM and synthesisers is gone. What you have now is TD: the band, that is still producing good (or bad) music depending on your taste, preconceptions and whether you love the technology more than the music (and there still are technology fan boys) who want to re live again and again a certain style.

If they've lost fans due to their change in style, then I say this...an artist does not produce art for fans passing tastes. Jerome said this recently, you listen to them but you don't play or compose what they want, that's art by community...you might as well let fans vote for chords changes and which sounds you use. The fans you have one day are the same that will be kicking your head in 6 months later (from memory TD had bomb threats and fans sending them their smashed records....and these are the fans! imagine what people who don't like them did).

where did that soap box come from? ;)

As unlikely as it sounds I do agree with you, it's just that perhaps I don't see things as 'black and white' as some.


Who is some?.... those who see things in Black and White are those who would say music fails so miserably due of its lack of popularity, don't you think?


I agree, to a certain extent TD ahve always been an unground group, only for a small group of people. If record sales equated merit then the Spice Girls are more influencial than Stockhausen, or Glass or Riley or Reich.

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 20, 2007 8:16 pm 
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:shock: :shock: :shock: Imagine that :lol: :arrow:

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 20, 2007 8:57 pm 
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epsilon75 wrote:
:shock: :shock: :shock: Imagine that :lol: :arrow:


I'm certain that TD will be remembered in the long run, as long as you ask the people that really matter in music such as musicians, music historians and teachers etc. That is a better standard to judge by than passing popularity. Such is their musical originality that The Open University had one of their tracks from Sorcerer as part of the course material on one of their CDs a few years ago. I still have the disc. Hope it's very rare :D

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 20, 2007 9:30 pm 
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Desert_Voyager wrote:
epsilon75 wrote:
:shock: :shock: :shock: Imagine that :lol: :arrow:


I'm certain that TD will be remembered in the long run, as long as you ask the people that really matter in music such as musicians, music historians and teachers etc. That is a better standard to judge by than passing popularity. Such is their musical originality that The Open University had one of their tracks from Sorcerer as part of the course material on one of their CDs a few years ago. I still have the disc. Hope it's very rare :D



Dont want to sell it Jason do yah :wink: :wink:

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 21, 2007 12:07 am 
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epsilon75 wrote:
Desert_Voyager wrote:
epsilon75 wrote:
:shock: :shock: :shock: Imagine that :lol: :arrow:


I'm certain that TD will be remembered in the long run, as long as you ask the people that really matter in music such as musicians, music historians and teachers etc. That is a better standard to judge by than passing popularity. Such is their musical originality that The Open University had one of their tracks from Sorcerer as part of the course material on one of their CDs a few years ago. I still have the disc. Hope it's very rare :D



Dont want to sell it Jason do yah :wink: :wink:


Nah Colin, I'm gonna keep it forever along with my playing heavy metal records cd of Flashpoint which I am sentimental about....I bought that one when I was doing fruit picking in Kent in my early twenties.... special days they were.... :D

I do wonder if the Open Uni CD is worth much though.

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PostPosted: Thu Mar 22, 2007 6:58 pm 
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Ok, i get it. My chances are slim to none of seeing them again over hear.

Any idea how many people on this forum are from the U.S.?

Oh, and has there been a thread to what other TD fans listen too that are similar to TD? Although not a direct comparison, I saw Massive Attack last year for the first time and was blown away by the music.

Stevo

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PostPosted: Thu Mar 22, 2007 7:32 pm 
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stevo4 wrote:
Ok, i get it. My chances are slim to none of seeing them again over hear.

Any idea how many people on this forum are from the U.S.?

Oh, and has there been a thread to what other TD fans listen too that are similar to TD? Although not a direct comparison, I saw Massive Attack last year for the first time and was blown away by the music.

Stevo


I wouldn't be so despondent Stevo, I fully expect TD to visit the US in 2007/08, although I wouldn't count on a full tour. As for forum fans other tastes, these can be witnessed in the music thread on the TD Fan Portfolio section.

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PostPosted: Thu Mar 29, 2007 6:33 pm 
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Bit quiet on the World Tour, actually make that...very quiet

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PostPosted: Thu Mar 29, 2007 6:37 pm 
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24db wrote:
Bit quiet on the World Tour, actually make that...very quiet


I must admit Andy this being the official 40th year of TD i thought we would have heard an announcement of some kind :arrow:

Perhaps JFs solo career may have put a small spanner in the works :?

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PostPosted: Thu Mar 29, 2007 6:39 pm 
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epsilon75 wrote:
24db wrote:
Bit quiet on the World Tour, actually make that...very quiet


I must admit Andy this being the official 40th year of TD i thought we would have heard an announcement of some kind :arrow:

Perhaps JFs solo career may have put a small spanner in the works :?


Hmmm maybe, but to speculate wouldn't add much light. If TD are now Edgar and Thorsten then there's nothing stopping them touring bar...money, energy, the will to do it and some very very complex organisation...apart from that it's a piece of **** ;)

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