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 Post subject: TD live....the future
PostPosted: Sun Dec 24, 2006 11:05 pm 
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Ok, a few thoughts about how TD and technology will change in the years to come. In recent years TD's equipment has been shrinking (Edgar has often said that TD don't need to take so much equipment with them anymore, but to a certain degree fans expect some amount equipment on stage). In 1996 I hear they tried to hire a number of samplers for their SBE gig in London, but they couldn't get them, so they had to take 'almost' all of their studio on tour (At the time their samplers were loading samples in live during the concert from a professional minidisc recorder). By the time of the RFH gig in 2004 TD had developed a new system where samples were loaded live into the equipment via ISDN lines from their Berlin studio, but to be honest I've no idea whether this was ever used live. Perhaps the developments in hard drive capacity now make the idea obsolete?

This begs the question, which way now for TD? less seems to be the order of the day, so how far can they go, 1 or 2 keyboards, and a computer? less? a controller with computer? virtual keyboards and 3D glasses? Touch screens? Edgar's imfamous E-Balls and Plasma units? Obviously the technology shouldn't be the main focus of the gig, but every system (however neutral) effects the music it produces, however subtlety.

Expect the unexpected! :)


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PostPosted: Sun Dec 24, 2006 11:09 pm 
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I never expect anything but the unexpected from TD :? :wink:

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RIP Edgar. I am going to miss you.


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PostPosted: Sun Dec 24, 2006 11:10 pm 
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epsilon75 wrote:
I never expect anything but the unexpected from TD :? :wink:


:D well said


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PostPosted: Sun Dec 24, 2006 11:16 pm 
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Being a total EM heretic I've got to be honest and say I'm not fussed how TD produce their music, as long as they are still producing it, I really don't care. I've kinda noticed over the years that the number of large boxes on stage with TD have slowly been decreasing but it's never effected my enjoyment of the show. To some extent I do miss those big boxes with all the synchronised flashing lights on, they were cool.

(CM's EM kudos = zero). :oops:


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PostPosted: Sun Dec 24, 2006 11:21 pm 
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Chris Monk wrote:
Being a total EM heretic I've got to be honest and say I'm not fussed how TD produce their music, as long as they are still producing it, I really don't care. I've kinda noticed over the years that the number of large boxes on stage with TD have slowly been decreasing but it's never effected my enjoyment of the show. To some extent I do miss those big boxes with all the synchronised flashing lights on, they were cool.

(CM's EM kudos = zero). :oops:


Big boxes with flashing lights are always cool, DJs love 'em ;)


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 25, 2006 3:57 pm 
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24db wrote:
Ok, a few thoughts about how TD and technology will change in the years to come. In recent years TD's equipment has been shrinking (Edgar has often said that TD don't need to take so much equipment with them anymore, but to a certain degree fans expect some amount equipment on stage). In 1996 I hear they tried to hire a number of samplers for their SBE gig in London, but they couldn't get them, so they had to take 'almost' all of their studio on tour (At the time their samplers were loading samples in live during the concert from a professional minidisc recorder). By the time of the RFH gig in 2004 TD had developed a new system where samples were loaded live into the equipment via ISDN lines from their Berlin studio, but to be honest I've no idea whether this was ever used live. Perhaps the developments in hard drive capacity now make the idea obsolete?

This begs the question, which way now for TD? less seems to be the order of the day, so how far can they go, 1 or 2 keyboards, and a computer? less? a controller with computer? virtual keyboards and 3D glasses? Touch screens? Edgar's imfamous E-Balls and Plasma units? Obviously the technology shouldn't be the main focus of the gig, but every system (however neutral) effects the music it produces, however subtlety.

Expect the unexpected! :)


Andy, I noticed from the Tempodrome DVD they do use software synths...also I heard Kraftwerk no longer bring their KlingKlang instruments to stage but also just the laptops. You saw them in 2004 didn't you? :D

In fact, considering a lot of the sounds are not produced instantly in synchronicity with the hand movement, much is just mimicking unless an actual guitar or keyboard is played. Much of the concerts that I have seen this year only have musicians clicking the mouse...

It seems to me seeing a very lively Iris playing her percussion kits is far more likely than the Moog Modulator in future... and probably much preferred 8)


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 25, 2006 4:15 pm 
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tangram80 wrote:
24db wrote:
Ok, a few thoughts about how TD and technology will change in the years to come. In recent years TD's equipment has been shrinking (Edgar has often said that TD don't need to take so much equipment with them anymore, but to a certain degree fans expect some amount equipment on stage). In 1996 I hear they tried to hire a number of samplers for their SBE gig in London, but they couldn't get them, so they had to take 'almost' all of their studio on tour (At the time their samplers were loading samples in live during the concert from a professional minidisc recorder). By the time of the RFH gig in 2004 TD had developed a new system where samples were loaded live into the equipment via ISDN lines from their Berlin studio, but to be honest I've no idea whether this was ever used live. Perhaps the developments in hard drive capacity now make the idea obsolete?

This begs the question, which way now for TD? less seems to be the order of the day, so how far can they go, 1 or 2 keyboards, and a computer? less? a controller with computer? virtual keyboards and 3D glasses? Touch screens? Edgar's imfamous E-Balls and Plasma units? Obviously the technology shouldn't be the main focus of the gig, but every system (however neutral) effects the music it produces, however subtlety.

Expect the unexpected! :)


Andy, I noticed from the Tempodrome DVD they do use software synths...also I heard Kraftwerk no longer bring their KlingKlang instruments to stage but also just the laptops. You saw them in 2004 didn't you? :D

In fact, considering a lot of the sounds are not produced instantly in synchronicity with the hand movement, much is just mimicking unless an actual guitar or keyboard is played. Much of the concerts that I have seen this year only have musicians clicking the mouse...

It seems to me seeing a very lively Iris playing her percussion kits is far more likely than the Moog Modulator in future... and probably much preferred 8)


Hi Jeffrey, yes Krafwerk just use Laptops (I caught them live in London at the Royal Festival Hall Ether festival.....see TD's comments about this festival).

Back on topic, hmmm how can I put this...TD's equipment is producing the sound, how much 'user' input actually controls the timing and note information is debatable (IMHO....obviously I have no knowledge of how TD perform, so my comments should, as always ;) be taken with a pinch of salt). I can except that TD perform live, but I'm not sure whether the group think they need to 'show' that they playing more than they really are; Thorsten playing several sequences by hand on DVD is stretching my imagination too far (although I might add that he has the technique to play 'if' he wanted to) as is Bernards guitar on Underwater sunlight, which in my opinion is just coming off hard drive, it's the same timing, exact guitar timbre and notes that are in Underwater Sunlight.

But these are minor technical issues and they take nothing away from TD's live presence and performance.


Last edited by 24db on Mon Dec 25, 2006 4:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Dec 25, 2006 4:20 pm 
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I'm sorry everyone, but I'd love to see some improvisation coming back in.

I'm not suggesting for one minute that TD resurrect their old analogue equipment (they probably sold it all years ago), but I think it would be great if they could maybe start with a well known piece and then have an improvised section, gradually reverting to a conventional conclusion...

Sorry, It's the wine talking (Merry Christmas all), but playing or doodling over existing tracks isn't my idea of a gig and I wouldn't make the effort to attend if that was all I was going to see or hear.....


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Dec 25, 2006 4:30 pm 
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DSJR wrote:
I'm sorry everyone, but I'd love to see some improvisation coming back in.

I'm not suggesting for one minute that TD resurrect their old analogue equipment (they probably sold it all years ago), but I think it would be great if they could maybe start with a well known piece and then have an improvised section, gradually reverting to a conventional conclusion...

Sorry, It's the wine talking (Merry Christmas all), but playing or doodling over existing tracks isn't my idea of a gig and I wouldn't make the effort to attend if that was all I was going to see or hear.....


Well, that's a choice we all have to make, in the end it's if you don't like it, don't go and see them or find another group that offers 'you' more of what you enjoy. More me a gig is 'more' than just the means of performing and the percentage of music playing by Edgar's big thumb and index finger ;)

TD will never go back to previous ways of performing, you only have to listen to Edgar for a few minutes to understand that.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Dec 25, 2006 5:28 pm 
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DSJR wrote:
(…) I'm not suggesting for one minute that TD resurrect their old analogue equipment (they probably sold it all years ago)(…)


Speaking of analog, did you notice that the new FAQ promises an unplugged album in the future? At least that one won't be played (if it gets a live premier in the first place) :)


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Dec 25, 2006 5:31 pm 
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24db wrote:
DSJR wrote:
I'm sorry everyone, but I'd love to see some improvisation coming back in.

I'm not suggesting for one minute that TD resurrect their old analogue equipment (they probably sold it all years ago), but I think it would be great if they could maybe start with a well known piece and then have an improvised section, gradually reverting to a conventional conclusion...

Sorry, It's the wine talking (Merry Christmas all), but playing or doodling over existing tracks isn't my idea of a gig and I wouldn't make the effort to attend if that was all I was going to see or hear.....


Well, that's a choice we all have to make, in the end it's if you don't like it, don't go and see them or find another group that offers 'you' more of what you enjoy. More me a gig is 'more' than just the means of performing and the percentage of music playing by Edgar's big thumb and index finger ;)

TD will never go back to previous ways of performing, you only have to listen to Edgar for a few minutes to understand that.



I think EF has made this plain on many occasions in interviews,No Baumann No Franke and no more improvisations on analogue equipment
:( Dont get me wrong,nothing would give me greater pleasure that seeing it,but its never going to happen..................TD have moved on and some people still have their asses stuck firm in 1975,and i was one of them :oops:

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Dec 25, 2006 5:37 pm 
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epsilon75 wrote:
24db wrote:
DSJR wrote:
I'm sorry everyone, but I'd love to see some improvisation coming back in.

I'm not suggesting for one minute that TD resurrect their old analogue equipment (they probably sold it all years ago), but I think it would be great if they could maybe start with a well known piece and then have an improvised section, gradually reverting to a conventional conclusion...

Sorry, It's the wine talking (Merry Christmas all), but playing or doodling over existing tracks isn't my idea of a gig and I wouldn't make the effort to attend if that was all I was going to see or hear.....


Well, that's a choice we all have to make, in the end it's if you don't like it, don't go and see them or find another group that offers 'you' more of what you enjoy. More me a gig is 'more' than just the means of performing and the percentage of music playing by Edgar's big thumb and index finger ;)

TD will never go back to previous ways of performing, you only have to listen to Edgar for a few minutes to understand that.



I think EF has made this plain on many occasions in interviews,No Baumann No Franke and no more improvisations on analogue equipment
:( Dont get me wrong,nothing would give me greater pleasure that seeing it,but its never going to happen..................TD have moved on and some people still have their asses stuck firm in 1975,and i was one of them :oops:


There's an old saying mate 'you can't step into the same river twice', even if Edgar et al 'wanted to' you wouldn't get Chris, Peter, Johannes or Paul as they were, you get them as they are 'now'...they've changed and moved on (unlike a few fans). You cannot dictate to an artist how they produce art, if you do you kill the spark to produce whatever they live for and all you get is a musical winner who serves their master as a slave (just my opinion I should add, nothing more)

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Dec 25, 2006 5:39 pm 
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24db wrote:
epsilon75 wrote:
24db wrote:
DSJR wrote:
I'm sorry everyone, but I'd love to see some improvisation coming back in.

I'm not suggesting for one minute that TD resurrect their old analogue equipment (they probably sold it all years ago), but I think it would be great if they could maybe start with a well known piece and then have an improvised section, gradually reverting to a conventional conclusion...

Sorry, It's the wine talking (Merry Christmas all), but playing or doodling over existing tracks isn't my idea of a gig and I wouldn't make the effort to attend if that was all I was going to see or hear.....


Well, that's a choice we all have to make, in the end it's if you don't like it, don't go and see them or find another group that offers 'you' more of what you enjoy. More me a gig is 'more' than just the means of performing and the percentage of music playing by Edgar's big thumb and index finger ;)

TD will never go back to previous ways of performing, you only have to listen to Edgar for a few minutes to understand that.



I think EF has made this plain on many occasions in interviews,No Baumann No Franke and no more improvisations on analogue equipment
:( Dont get me wrong,nothing would give me greater pleasure that seeing it,but its never going to happen..................TD have moved on and some people still have their asses stuck firm in 1975,and i was one of them :oops:


There's an old saying mate 'you can't step into the same river twice', even if Edgar et al 'wanted to' you wouldn't get Chris, Peter, Johannes or Paul as they were, you get them as they are 'now'...they've changed and moved on (unlike a few fans). You cannot dictate to an artist how they produce art, if you do you kill the spark to produce whatever they live for and all you get is a musical winner who serves their master as a slave (just my opinion I should add, nothing more)



And i agree with your opinion,and certainly have moved on :wink:

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Dec 25, 2006 6:20 pm 
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epsilon75 wrote:
24db wrote:
epsilon75 wrote:
24db wrote:
DSJR wrote:
I'm sorry everyone, but I'd love to see some improvisation coming back in.

I'm not suggesting for one minute that TD resurrect their old analogue equipment (they probably sold it all years ago), but I think it would be great if they could maybe start with a well known piece and then have an improvised section, gradually reverting to a conventional conclusion...

Sorry, It's the wine talking (Merry Christmas all), but playing or doodling over existing tracks isn't my idea of a gig and I wouldn't make the effort to attend if that was all I was going to see or hear.....


Well, that's a choice we all have to make, in the end it's if you don't like it, don't go and see them or find another group that offers 'you' more of what you enjoy. More me a gig is 'more' than just the means of performing and the percentage of music playing by Edgar's big thumb and index finger ;)

TD will never go back to previous ways of performing, you only have to listen to Edgar for a few minutes to understand that.



I think EF has made this plain on many occasions in interviews,No Baumann No Franke and no more improvisations on analogue equipment
:( Dont get me wrong,nothing would give me greater pleasure that seeing it,but its never going to happen..................TD have moved on and some people still have their asses stuck firm in 1975,and i was one of them :oops:


There's an old saying mate 'you can't step into the same river twice', even if Edgar et al 'wanted to' you wouldn't get Chris, Peter, Johannes or Paul as they were, you get them as they are 'now'...they've changed and moved on (unlike a few fans). You cannot dictate to an artist how they produce art, if you do you kill the spark to produce whatever they live for and all you get is a musical winner who serves their master as a slave (just my opinion I should add, nothing more)



And i agree with your opinion,and certainly have moved on :wink:


I just asked Peter and he just gave me this look ;)

Image

_________________
http://thezest-2010.blogspot.co.uk/
small print


Last edited by 24db on Mon Dec 25, 2006 7:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Dec 25, 2006 6:32 pm 
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24db wrote:
epsilon75 wrote:
24db wrote:
epsilon75 wrote:
24db wrote:
DSJR wrote:
I'm sorry everyone, but I'd love to see some improvisation coming back in.

I'm not suggesting for one minute that TD resurrect their old analogue equipment (they probably sold it all years ago), but I think it would be great if they could maybe start with a well known piece and then have an improvised section, gradually reverting to a conventional conclusion...

Sorry, It's the wine talking (Merry Christmas all), but playing or doodling over existing tracks isn't my idea of a gig and I wouldn't make the effort to attend if that was all I was going to see or hear.....


Well, that's a choice we all have to make, in the end it's if you don't like it, don't go and see them or find another group that offers 'you' more of what you enjoy. More me a gig is 'more' than just the means of performing and the percentage of music playing by Edgar's big thumb and index finger ;)

TD will never go back to previous ways of performing, you only have to listen to Edgar for a few minutes to understand that.



I think EF has made this plain on many occasions in interviews,No Baumann No Franke and no more improvisations on analogue equipment
:( Dont get me wrong,nothing would give me greater pleasure that seeing it,but its never going to happen..................TD have moved on and some people still have their asses stuck firm in 1975,and i was one of them :oops:


There's an old saying mate 'you can't step into the same river twice', even if Edgar et al 'wanted to' you wouldn't get Chris, Peter, Johannes or Paul as they were, you get them as they are 'now'...they've changed and moved on (unlike a few fans). You cannot dictate to an artist how they produce art, if you do you kill the spark to produce whatever they live for and all you get is a musical winner who serves their master as a slave (just my opinion I should add, nothing more)



And i agree with your opinion,and certainly have moved on :wink:


I just asked Peter and just gave me this look ;)

Image


Some good Morrocan involved there i'd say :shock:

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