Tangerine Dream 5 CD box-set

tdfan · Post by **tdfan** » Mon Mar 12, 2012 12:58 pm

What are your opinions about the sound quality of the 1995 remasters? Are these the best versions available on CD?

sparrow · Post by **sparrow** » Mon Mar 12, 2012 2:12 pm

The first edition of Encore sounds better than the remaster IMO...the rest do sound slightly better than their earlier editions..

multivit72 · Post by **multivit72** » Mon Mar 12, 2012 4:38 pm

For me, Tangram is a definitive improvement... (thats the only one I have 2 editions of)

Marc M · Post by **Marc M** » Sun Mar 18, 2012 1:51 am

tdfan wrote:What are your opinions about the sound quality of the 1995 remasters? Are these the best versions available on CD?

Yes, I do think so. They have almost no nioice caused by tape hiss anymore ; the sound is more dynamic, brighter too, and *deeper*... It's particularly obvious on Stratosfear for instance.. or Tangram. It's really an improvement. I think the 1995 version of Encore is quite good...I had both versions but sold the first. It's then hard to compare again now. I could be lured by volume enhancement sometimes in the (distant) past, and I am not sure there was so much hiss noise on "Encore" but well, there was a lot on the others from that era, to the point I stopped re-buying the albums on CD's after a while ... I was happier with my old LP's and their good transfers on tapes. I bought one of the definitive editions just to check in the mid-late 90's, I picked up "Rubycon" and was really pleased. So I progressively bought the others from the 70's.

Yet, I'm not sure what they did on this box set that this thread is all about... I didn't have the chance to listen to it.

owen · Post by **owen** » Sun Mar 18, 2012 1:17 pm

I picked up Force Majeure & Exit on cd, not as the 1995 remasters. I think the sound quality would probably be better as remasters.

I'm not sure if that's the case for other albums.

I picked up the first Virgin years box set just to get Cyclone on cd. Then, a few months later, the Cyclone album appeared in shops on its own

Irritating, that, as I don't need that box-set.

As someone who knows TD only for the last couple of years I don't actually know, but I think the 1995 remasters have a more bass-heavy and compressed sound to the originals. That may suit a lot of rock music, but it mightn't suit TD as the wide dynamics ('soundscapes') is really their thing more than a rock'n'roll punch.

I heard original recordings from Stratosfear, Encore, Logos and Poland before I got the albums, as remasters. The albums sounded a little "duller" or less dynamic than I expected in terms of the sound mix.

Flashpoint · Post by **Flashpoint** » Tue Mar 20, 2012 5:22 am

tdfan wrote:What are your opinions about the sound quality of the 1995 remasters? Are these the best versions available on CD?

The 1995's are OK but I think the original's much more closely match the tone of the LP's and are more dynamic, therefore I feel the original's are overall better sound quality. The 1995 Encore and Tangram are especially dull. Well maybe not dull exactly, more like muted high end and middle range in contrast to the originals. They were probably noise reduced which back then was the style but engineers since have learned what a very bad thing that was. As Mastering Legend Bob Ludwig has said no engineer worth his salt uses Noise reduction anymore. Which really makes me wonder about what kind of amateurs work for Esoteric.

paul wood · Post by **paul wood** » Tue Mar 20, 2012 2:59 pm

In my opinion, the 1995 remaster of 'Encore' is the worst offender in the noise-reduction stakes. In attempting to eliminate the hiss on the opening of 'Monolight', the piano section suffered terribly. The end result to my ears sounded more like a low-fi recording plagued with drop-outs.

Flashpoint · Post by **Flashpoint** » Tue Mar 20, 2012 4:18 pm

tdfan wrote:What are your opinions about the sound quality of the 1995 remasters? Are these the best versions available on CD?

sparrow wrote:The first edition of Encore sounds better than the remaster....

Flashpoint wrote: The 1995's are OK but I think the original's much more closely match the tone of the LP's and are more dynamic, therefore I feel the original's are overall better sound quality. The 1995 Encore and Tangram are especially dull. Well maybe not dull exactly, more like muted high end and middle range in contrast to the originals. They were probably noise reduced which back then was the style but engineers since have learned what a very bad thing that was. As Mastering Legend Bob Ludwig has said no engineer worth his salt uses Noise reduction anymore. Which really makes me wonder about what kind of amateurs work for Esoteric.

paul wood wrote:In my opinion, the 1995 remaster of 'Encore' is the worst offender in the noise-reduction stakes. In attempting to eliminate the hiss on the opening of 'Monolight', the piano section suffered terribly. The end result to my ears sounded more like a low-fi recording plagued with drop-outs.

Exactly Paul!

My friends I have almost all Virgin era TD CD , actually almost every CD issue of a 1973-1990 TD album. From my personal experiences this what I've learned.

- Original CD's - Sound quality is nearly always the best. It is the most life like, most Dynamic and closest to the Vinyl LP's in tone

Most of these were made from the original master tapes which at that point in time had little or no aging. If you like vinyl the originals are the closet thing. Linear notes for most albums are mostly non-existent.

Please note in some cases like Poland the original USA CD is far better than the Europe issue. Or the reverse like for Exit where the original Europe CD is much better than the USA.

- 1990's remasters [including the "20-Bit"] - "muted", cold and lifeless sound due to the now very dated [out of date] 90's mastering style. Not even close to the vinyl in tone. Linear notes and artwork usually nice but not necessarily the original cover art.

- early 2000's remasters - much more life than the 1990's remasters. Tone is still not good. Loss of Dynamics due to the discs being made louder which is a style that exists to today. This style to me does not fit TD's type of music. Linear notes and artwork usually nice but not necessarily the original cover art.

- recent Esoteric - back to the 1990's Noise Reduced "muted", cold and lifeless sound. My opinion is they have inexperienced engineer's. These also have Loss of Dynamics due to the discs being made louder. Tone is nothing like the vinyl. In effect the worst of the 1990's and 2000's combined. I do not believe master tapes were used for any of these. Linear notes and Art are the best ever but not necessarily the original cover art.

I realize many will disagree with my opinions, but if you are truly a TD fan then you owe it to yourself to compare at least all CD versions of 1 album [like Encore] in order to come to an informed decision. My friends do not go on old memories any audiologist [or ear nose throat Doctor] will tell you that sound memory fades after less then a few minutes.

mikewp · Post by **mikewp** » Tue Mar 20, 2012 4:22 pm

T4N63R1N3 DR34M wrote:£11.99 @ Play.com

Nice

Blast it...seems from the US I can't create a Play.com account, there's no option for the US as an address?

It'd be 19.99 from Play for me, as opposed to the 35.00 Amazon is asking. Hmmmmmmmm

tdfan · Post by **tdfan** » Mon Apr 02, 2012 12:10 pm

I ordered both box sets today. 12 of TD's best albums for £23 seems very reasonable.

epsilon75 · Post by **epsilon75** » Mon Apr 02, 2012 6:52 pm

This arrived today

very nice set for the price

Peter Beasley · Post by **Peter Beasley** » Thu Apr 05, 2012 7:27 pm

At last Virgin have realized that Johannes Schmoelling and not Peter Baumann co-composed 'Tangram'. But now, who is this 'Hans Baumann' credited as co-writing 'Encore'? Oh dear! Will they ever get it right.

sparrow · Post by **sparrow** » Thu Apr 05, 2012 9:43 pm

Peter Beasley wrote:At last Virgin have realized that Johannes Schmoelling and not Peter Baumann co-composed 'Tangram'. But now, who is this 'Hans Baumann' credited as co-writing 'Encore'? Oh dear! Will they ever get it right.

Hans is Peters middle name ...I think..

sparrow · Post by **sparrow** » Fri Apr 06, 2012 1:15 pm

sparrow wrote:
Peter Beasley wrote:At last Virgin have realized that Johannes Schmoelling and not Peter Baumann co-composed 'Tangram'. But now, who is this 'Hans Baumann' credited as co-writing 'Encore'? Oh dear! Will they ever get it right.
Hans is Peters middle name ...I think..

His full name is Hans Peter Baumann...

correct me if I'm wrong..

Peter Beasley · Post by **Peter Beasley** » Sat Apr 07, 2012 8:15 pm

sparrow wrote:
sparrow wrote: His full name is Hans Peter Baumann... correct me if I'm wrong..

Yes, apparently he dropped the Hans part in 1973 (though he was already using just Peter on Zeit in 1972). So the question is, who decided to drop the Peter and resurrect the Hans for this new CD set? Furthermore will all the back catalogue he appears on be changed when reprinted?

And Chris Franke is back to Christoph (though probably still Christopher for current use). As everyone seems to be getting on the name change bandwagon maybe we'll see credits to Wilmar Froese?